Author Topic: Relationships: Making Friends  (Read 12157 times)

Offline Carl

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Relationships: Making Friends
« on: November 03, 2014, 08:33:11 PM »
I'm making a big section on socializing within the game, and I want it to be detailed and helpful. This is the first version of my Relationships and Making Friends Guide. I plan to improve it, and hope to get some input from the community on areas where it can be improved. I figured I had enough to say that anyone who struggles with making friends with Sims will find the info they need to improve at that part of the game. I'd love any feedback, suggestions, etc. I hope to get more specifics on how things work from the XML, but there is a lot to go through.

There is a lot of info on the board that I need to look at and edit into the pages. I'll get to that later this week. I want to do a page on Romance and Woohoo as soon as I am able.

Offline Playalot

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Re: Relationships: Making Friends
« Reply #1 on: November 04, 2014, 12:31:52 AM »
Great guide, as always. Just a few thoughts, don't know if they fit with your vision for the guide but here they are anyway:

- you can queue up two of exactly the same jokes at a time, both will get a ++ positive gain: if you try 3, the third one will bomb. This allows the jokes your sim has open to you get double mileage towards making a friend.

- being confident or playful are the best two emotions for your sim to be in to make friends. Mainly due to the fact that it opens up more social options even if your sim has a low charisma level.

- if the target sim walks away but your 'so' close to actually nailing the friendship you can always whip out a "travel here with" and take them back to your home where they will usually hang for some time allowing you to make that friendship happen.

- asking another sim to mentor you at the gym is a winner. Your sim gets fit quicker and by the end of the mentoring your sim will usually be good friends with the sim that was doing the mentoring. After that have a quick chat and your sim should be able to find out most if not all of their traits.
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Offline Gogowars329

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Re: Relationships: Making Friends
« Reply #2 on: November 04, 2014, 04:43:23 AM »
Yes! This is exactly what I have been looking for! I can never seem to find my Sims friends and needing them for promotions is really killing me! Thanks Carl!
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Offline markarch

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Re: Relationships: Making Friends
« Reply #3 on: November 04, 2014, 05:23:08 AM »
Never tested it, but I think some of the jokes in funny interaction is very useful for group conversation. Everyone in the group seems to get ++ or + when some of the funny interaction is performed.

Addition: Chatting with on computer seem to be one of the best way of making friends since you don't have to queue several interaction so you can leave the to control other sims. It might be not as fast but it doesn't have a possibility of losing relationship, well at least for what I've done so far!


Offline _Annika_

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Re: Relationships: Making Friends
« Reply #4 on: November 04, 2014, 06:24:50 AM »
You can use just about any interaction twice in a row, at most. After that it becomes boring.

I find building friendships is easier one on one. It doesn't seem to increase as much in groups, but rather the increases are spread out among all the participants in the conversation.

Mood related interactions and charismatic interactions give better bonuses, as well as trait related bonuses, such as debating best captains with geeks, or compliment outfit for a materialistic sim.

Work on a cycle of at least 3 different interactions. It seems to have a similar design to Sims 2, remembering only 3 interactions at a time. I just cycle through all that I have available to me, and then start back at the beginning. This way it is easy to max both relationship bars on one sim by mid-afternoon of the first day.

Watch for any conflicts of interest or mood, as your sims may end up bored or embarrassed.

Offline DarkWalker

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Re: Relationships: Making Friends
« Reply #5 on: November 04, 2014, 07:31:43 AM »
This is the raw(ish) data I've collected in the past. The numbers are the bonus, or penalty, to the final scoring of the social interaction if the sim (or target sim) has the trait, mood, or other characteristic specified to the right. When there are multiple values separated by commas they correspond to the intensity of whichever characteristic is listed to the right, when they are separated by a semicolon the values to the left are for the actor and to the right are for the target.

Didn't post them before because they are, well, raw. They were also collected before the Ghosts patch and never updated. Might be useful, though.
(If you copy and paste them somewhere with constant spacing, such as Notepad, it will align better. Not perfectly, as I just made it neat enough for my own usage.)
Friendly:
   -03, -05                SocialContext_Awkwardness (Awkward, VeryAwkward)
   +06, -05, -10, -14      SocialContext_Friendship (Friendly, Distasteful, Offensive, Abhorrent)
   000, 000, -06, -10, -15 SocialContext_Fun (Hilarious, Funny, Boring, Tedious, InsufferablyTedious)
   000, 000, 000           SocialContext_Romance (Steamy, Amorous, Suggestive)
   +08, +05, 000, -02, -04, -08 LTR_Friendship_Main (+100 to +60, to +25, to -15, to -30, to -70, to -100)
   000, 000, 000, 000           LTR_Romance_Main (+100 to +50, to 0, to -50, to -100)
   -03, -06; -09, -14 Mood_Angry
   -02     ; 000      Mood_Bored
   +03, +03; 000, 000 Mood_Confident
   -03, -03; 000, -05 Mood_Embarrassed
   +02, +02; 000, 000 Mood_Energized
   000     ; 000      Mood_Fine
   +02, +02; 000, 000 Mood_Flirty
   +02, +02; 000, 000 Mood_Focused
   +05, +10; +05, +10 Mood_Happy
   +03, +03; 000, 000 Mood_Inspired
   +02, +02; 000, 000 Mood_Playful
   -03, -03; 000, -05 Mood_Sad
   -05     ; 000      Mood_Dazed
   -05, -10; 000, -05 Mood_Stressed
   -03, -08; 000, -05 Mood_Uncomfortable
   -15 TargetSim Buff_BrokenUpORDivorced_Hidden
   +8 friendship-bff

Romance:
   -23, -23                SocialContext_Awkwardness (Awkward, VeryAwkward)
   +04, -05, -20, -25      SocialContext_Friendship (Friendly, Distasteful, Offensive, Abhorrent)
   +04, +04, -05, -08, -15 SocialContext_Fun (Hilarious, Funny, Boring, Tedious, InsufferablyTedious)
   +12, +07, +05           SocialContext_Romance (Steamy, Amorous, Suggestive)
   +07, +06, +03, -03, -07, -12 LTR_Friendship_Main (+100 to +60, to +25, to -15, to -30, to -70, to -100)
   +25, +06, -03, -06           LTR_Romance_Main (+100 to +50, to 0, to -50, to -100)
   -03, -20; -08, -30 Mood_Angry
   -06     ; 000      Mood_Bored
   +04, +09; 000, 000 Mood_Confident
   -10, -10; 000, -10 Mood_Embarrassed
   +02, +02; 000, 000 Mood_Energized
   +02     ;      000 Mood_Fine
   +06, +16; +05, +15 Mood_Flirty
   +02, +02; 000, 000 Mood_Focused
   +04, +09; 000, +05 Mood_Happy
   +02, +02; 000, 000 Mood_Inspired
   +03, +03; 000, 000 Mood_Playful
   -05, -05; -12, -22 Mood_Sad
   +05     ; +10      Mood_Dazed
   -05, -05; 000, -05 Mood_Stressed
   -05, -05; 000, -05 Mood_Uncomfortable
   +02, +03, +06, +08, +12 Charisma 1 to 2, 3 to 4, 5 to 6, 7 to 8, 9 to 10
   +05 buff_Object_Drink_Flirty
   +04 trait_Alluring
   -05 TargetSim Buff_BrokenUpORDivorced_Hidden
   -18 Listener ShortTerm_JustBrokeUpOrDivorced
   +06 romantic-Engaged, romantic-Married, romantic-Significant_Other
   -08 TargetSim to Actor romantic-HasBeenUnfaithful
   -12 Hygiene LESS_OR_EQUAL -50
   -08 Hygiene EQUAL -100
   -10 testSet_InRelationships_NotTarget

Funny:
   +05, +02                SocialContext_Awkwardness (Awkward, VeryAwkward)
   +04, -07, -12, -20      SocialContext_Friendship (Friendly, Distasteful, Offensive, Abhorrent)
   +12, +06, -02, -07, -07 SocialContext_Fun (Hilarious, Funny, Boring, Tedious, InsufferablyTedious)
   +06, +06, +06           SocialContext_Romance (Steamy, Amorous, Suggestive)
   +05, 000, 000, 000, 000, 000 LTR_Friendship_Main (+100 to +60, to +25, to -15, to -30, to -70, to -100)
   000, 000, 000, 000           LTR_Romance_Main (+100 to +50, to 0, to -50, to -100)
   -04, -09; -06, -11 Mood_Angry
   +03     ; 000      Mood_Bored
   +05, +05; 000, 000 Mood_Confident
   -03, -03; +05, +15 Mood_Embarrassed
   +02, +02; 000, 000 Mood_Energized
   +01     ; 000      Mood_Fine
   +03, +03; +04, +04 Mood_Flirty
   +03, +08; 000, 000 Mood_Focused
   +03, +03; +04, +04 Mood_Happy
   +03, +03; 000, 000 Mood_Inspired
   +03, +13; 000, +10 Mood_Playful
   -07, -07; 000, 000 Mood_Sad
   +03     ; 000      Mood_Dazed
   -03, -03; 000, 000 Mood_Stressed
   -03, -03; -05, -05 Mood_Uncomfortable
   +02, +03, +04, +05, +06 Charisma 1 to 2, 3 to 4, 5 to 6, 7 to 8, 9 to 10

Mean:
   000, 000                SocialContext_Awkwardness (Awkward, VeryAwkward)
   000, 000, 000, +30      SocialContext_Friendship (Friendly, Distasteful, Offensive, Abhorrent)
   000, 000, 000, 000, 000 SocialContext_Fun (Hilarious, Funny, Boring, Tedious, InsufferablyTedious)
   000, 000, 000           SocialContext_Romance (Steamy, Amorous, Suggestive)
   000, 000, 000, 000, 000, 000 LTR_Friendship_Main (+100 to +60, to +25, to -15, to -30, to -70, to -100)
   000, 000, 000, 000           LTR_Romance_Main (+100 to +50, to 0, to -50, to -100)
   +12, +17; +08, +13 Mood_Angry
   000     ; 000      Mood_Bored
   000, 000; 000, 000 Mood_Confident
   000, 000; 000, 000 Mood_Embarrassed
   000, 000; 000, 000 Mood_Energized
   000     ; 000      Mood_Fine
   000, 000; 000, 000 Mood_Flirty
   000, 000; 000, 000 Mood_Focused
   000, 000; 000, 000 Mood_Happy
   000, 000; 000, 000 Mood_Inspired
   000, 000; 000, 000 Mood_Playful
   000, 000; 000, 000 Mood_Sad
   000     ; 000      Mood_Dazed
   000, 000; 000, 000 Mood_Stressed
   000, 000; 000, 000 Mood_Uncomfortable
   +20 testSet_ActorCHILD_TargetHatesChildren

Mischief:
   000, 000                SocialContext_Awkwardness (Awkward, VeryAwkward)
   +05, 000, 000, 000      SocialContext_Friendship (Friendly, Distasteful, Offensive, Abhorrent)
   000, 000, 000, 000, 000 SocialContext_Fun (Hilarious, Funny, Boring, Tedious, InsufferablyTedious)
   000, 000, 000           SocialContext_Romance (Steamy, Amorous, Suggestive)
   +08, +04, -02, -05, -10, -15 LTR_Friendship_Main (+100 to +60, to +25, to -15, to -30, to -70, to -100)
   000, 000, 000, 000           LTR_Romance_Main (+100 to +50, to 0, to -50, to -100)
   000, 000; -03, -08 Mood_Angry
   000     ; 000      Mood_Bored
   +04, +04; 000, 000 Mood_Confident
   -05, -05; +03, +03 Mood_Embarrassed
   +03, +03; 000, 000 Mood_Energized
   000     ; 000      Mood_Fine
   000, 000; 000, 000 Mood_Flirty
   +08, +18; -15, -25 Mood_Focused
   000, 000; 000, 000 Mood_Happy
   000, 000; 000, 000 Mood_Inspired
   +05, +10; +05, +10 Mood_Playful
   000, 000; 000, 000 Mood_Sad
   -04     ; +08      Mood_Dazed
   -02, -02; -03, -03 Mood_Stressed
   -02, -02; +03, +03 Mood_Uncomfortable
   +02, +02, +03, +03, +03, +04, +04, +05, +05, +06 Charisma 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10
   -05 Listener Mischief 2
   -07 Listener Mischief 4
   -09 Listener Mischief 6
   -04 Mischief less than listener
   +04 TargetSim trait_Good
   -05 TargetSim trait_Genius
   000 TargetSim trait_HotHeaded
   +06 TargetSim trait_Insane
   +05 trait_Evil
   +02 trait_Insane
   +01 trait_Good
   -10 career_Adult_Criminal 1+

Offline Lisa46

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Re: Relationships: Making Friends
« Reply #6 on: November 04, 2014, 12:31:51 PM »
It's great how hygiene and the rest effect it.

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Offline Carl

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Re: Relationships: Making Friends
« Reply #7 on: November 04, 2014, 02:35:12 PM »
These are just the kinds of tips I was looking to incorporate into it, so thank you all. I should've realized you can use two interactions in a row without it being boring. It was the same in TS3. Knowing that you can use the same one on a Sim and cycle through just a couple should help people befriend the Sims that just don't seem to want friends. I am also a little surprised I didn't notice jokes working on groups, and might try to see if any other types of socials (storytelling?) will work on all the Sims around instead of just the target. This will definitely improve the guide for future visitors :)

I will definitely add at least some of this to the page, DarkWalker, although I'm not sure how I'll do it just yet - but I will likely link people who want ALL the data to your post. It's really good to know that Mischief, Romance, and Funny interactions are all boosted by Charisma, but where is that under Friendly? Strange! This means that mischief interactions will be more likely to be taken positively with Charisma, as are jokes. I need to edit all three guides for that info along with this page.

On Thursday or Friday I'll put up a list of all the pages that got edits and what was changed. If someone has anything else to add for this one, please do! I never did get around to my first guide for Civ Beyond Earth and am going to work on my notes for that the next two days.

I'm personally a little bored with skill guides and like digging into this type of stuff, so will try and get Parties out sooner rather than later along with expanding this section on relationships. Thankfully only Piano and Mixology are left. I think I will try to cover family more thoroughly this time around, but am not sure what direction I'll go sometimes until I have notepad open in front of me :)

Offline Stormi71

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Re: Relationships: Making Friends
« Reply #8 on: November 04, 2014, 03:16:07 PM »
I seem to have trouble making friends. I seemed to make friends kind of easily to start with, but the relationship seemed to decay pretty quickly. My Sim is trying to make friends with everyone again, and she is at level 10 charisma now, and it doesn't seem to make a difference. She's also cheerful and gregarious.
Also, being mentored at the gym, I'm presuming you have to introduce yourself first for a relationship gain while being mentored, because if I just click "ask to mentor", I get no relationship gain.

Offline Carl

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Re: Relationships: Making Friends
« Reply #9 on: November 04, 2014, 03:29:49 PM »
Thanks for the tip. I'll mention mentoring in the making friends area, as Metro has told me it's pretty good. I'll give it a try myself.

It seems relationships just decay faster in this version. I've seen a mod to make that slower or disable it, but hope the developers might tune it a little bit so people don't feel they need one.

Offline Stormi71

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Re: Relationships: Making Friends
« Reply #10 on: November 04, 2014, 04:35:42 PM »
I also noticed something yesterday. I don't tend to play different households all that often, I have one family that I focus on. But I did swap households yesterday and I checked the sims relationship panel and one of them had a LOT of friends, there were at least 15 that were friend status. The other sims had a few friends, too. So maybe that would help with that popularity aspiration, to play a different household for a while, then come back and instantly have a bunch of friends?
I will also check that mentoring thing. I have just been clicking "ask to mentor" and at the end, the relationship bar is still at zero. I will try introducing my sim first and then be mentored, just to be sure it's not a glitch.

Offline Stormi71

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Re: Relationships: Making Friends
« Reply #11 on: November 05, 2014, 01:36:25 AM »
Well in my testing, the relationship bar didn't go up if you ask a stranger to mentor you, but if they mentor you, THEN introduce yourself, the relationship jumps up to friend. So the progress is there, it just doesn't show until you officially introduce yourself.
Then I realised that MY sim could mentor others at the gym, so I did that and quickly made a bunch of friends. There is a Mentor reward trait, so I wonder if mentoring in other areas would build up relationships just as quickly as at the gym?

Offline DarkWalker

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Re: Relationships: Making Friends
« Reply #12 on: November 05, 2014, 02:49:10 PM »
Double checked it, and no, there is no directly influence from Charisma into the scoring of friendly interactions. I wouldn't discard it influencing the results in other ways, though; the scoring is only part of what determines the result, for a full picture you would also need to look at the loot files and each of the dozens of individual interactions, at least. Also (though not in the data I posted), it does influence the availability of friendly interactions.

That data comes from the tuning files that start with scores_socialoutcomes_ in the folder test_based_score, BTW. It's fairly straightforward, just inconvenient to read directly from the files.

Offline Carl

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Re: Relationships: Making Friends
« Reply #13 on: November 05, 2014, 03:53:07 PM »
Thanks, DarkWalker! That will definitely help and makes me feel better about saying that Charisma is important for Friendly interactions. I did feel a difference, myself, but I will say that most of that was coming from great interactions like Brighten Day.

Stormi71, I will absolutely mention Mentoring now that you've given it a huge vote of confidence. It deserves a good paragraph explaining how great it is for making friends :)

I'm glad I waited for some further information. Everything you all provided will be worked into the Guide soon.. ;D

Offline Playalot

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Re: Relationships: Making Friends
« Reply #14 on: November 05, 2014, 04:01:16 PM »
About mentoring, my experience is different. Every time I have asked a stranger to mentor my sim at the gym the friendship increases steadily without having being introduced first. My sim can get all the way to good friends without even having spoken a word to the mentoring sim. When my sim talks to them after the mentoring is over they can then learn their traits easily. It's easy to see the double ++ interactions flying as my sim is being mentored. You can also repeatedly ask the same sim to mentor you all with way to a full green bar without having been introduced first.

*Edited....sorry, wrong info sims have to be introduced BEFORE the mentoring can happen! Looks like my game was glitched. (Darn, it was a really handy glitch too!) ::)
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Offline Stormi71

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Re: Relationships: Making Friends
« Reply #15 on: November 06, 2014, 03:35:34 AM »
About mentoring, my experience is different. Every time I have asked a stranger to mentor my sim at the gym the friendship increases steadily without having being introduced first. My sim can get all the way to good friends without even having spoken a word to the mentoring sim. When my sim talks to them after the mentoring is over they can then learn their traits easily. It's easy to see the double ++ interactions flying as my sim is being mentored. You can also repeatedly ask the same sim to mentor you all with way to a full green bar without having been introduced first.
Maybe mine was a glitch? With my sim doing the mentoring, she just went up to everyone at the gym and mentored them, without talking to them, and the friendship went up. But the other way around it wouldn't change, no matter which sim was mentoring.

Offline Playalot

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Re: Relationships: Making Friends
« Reply #16 on: November 06, 2014, 04:06:28 AM »
@ Stormi71, I don't know. It does sound like a glitch. All the sims I've made have made friends easily by being mentored at the gym without being introduced. I usually head to the gym within minutes of starting a new game and hey-presto! at least two new friends by end of gym session, more if I take the time to stay and chat afterwards. (Remembering that you can chat to non-mentoring sims while being mentored, so you can actually build two friend a once.)

EDITED: wow! Sorry, my bad, it was MY game that had the glitch! I repaired my game in Origin today and started a brand new game with a brand new sim I made in CAS and the option to mentor was NOT there until I introduced myself! Sorry for the wrong info! However, after a quick intro, it's all on!
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Offline Stormi71

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Re: Relationships: Making Friends
« Reply #17 on: November 06, 2014, 04:08:16 PM »
See, I think something is odd somewhere. I get the mentor option come up on a sim even if I haven't introduced myself. It only comes up if I'm already on some gym equipment, though. I don't know if Mentor is meant to come up if you aren't on some equipment.
I will play a different sim today (my main sims know the sims that can mentor), and get them to be mentored without knowing the sim first, and see what happens and pay more attention.

Offline Carl

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Re: Relationships: Making Friends
« Reply #18 on: November 06, 2014, 05:09:57 PM »
I just edited the page to include a link to DarkWalker's post showing specific scores, and also summarized some of what can be learned from it for people who don't care to see all the data.

I also threw in a bit about Mentoring and how you can ask to be Mentored to eventually become better at Fitness and Mentor others.

The fact that you can use Socials twice is mentioned, using 'Visit Here With', emotions unlocking intearctions, that you can chat with specific Sims at the computer, and that jokes may affect groups is also in. All in all, I got almost everything you guys mentioned here incorporated into the guide! I'll certainly direct people to this page when doing Romance so as to avoid repetition. This extra information will help a lot of people. Thanks again, gang!

Offline Stormi71

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Re: Relationships: Making Friends
« Reply #19 on: November 06, 2014, 05:42:13 PM »
I started using the "chat with" on the computer because I read it can help to make friends more easily. I found it an easy way to bump up the friendship bar, or maintain a friendship. Plus when they are doing that, they don't just randomly stop like they do when doing other activities. It's helpful if you have a few sims in your household, just make one chat on the computer and leave them be for a couple of hours. I make my teen sims chat with someone before school if they are up early enough, but I have to watch them because they won't stop chatting to go to school (kind of like real life lol)

Offline Carl

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Re: Relationships: Making Friends
« Reply #20 on: November 06, 2014, 06:21:51 PM »
Haha indeed. I was able to use Chat With to turn someone who disliked my Sim into a friend, however slowly. It just seems like they don't annoy each other as much with that, so it gives a steady stream of positive standing. Great stuff.

Offline slightlyaddicted

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Re: Relationships: Making Friends
« Reply #21 on: November 09, 2014, 05:02:27 PM »
I just discovered another relationship level that I didn't see on your guide but I'm not sure if it would go under romantic or friends. It's "just friends". I got it by having a friend bar below friend level and a romance bar at the same time.

Offline Stormi71

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Re: Relationships: Making Friends
« Reply #22 on: November 09, 2014, 05:12:16 PM »
I just discovered another relationship level that I didn't see on your guide but I'm not sure if it would go under romantic or friends. It's "just friends". I got it by having a friend bar below friend level and a romance bar at the same time.
I recently saw this with both my teen sims. Teen 1's romance level was full, but now it's dropped to zero again, but even though they are friends, it still says "just friends". Teen 2 has a friend who seems to be quite flirty with him, he doesn't flirt back, but that also has the "just friends" relationship.

Offline ladybug53

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Re: Relationships: Making Friends
« Reply #23 on: November 09, 2014, 05:32:13 PM »
I just discovered another relationship level that I didn't see on your guide but I'm not sure if it would go under romantic or friends. It's "just friends". I got it by having a friend bar below friend level and a romance bar at the same time.

I just noticed this myself today as well . My sim was friend with this female and had just started flirting with her and that's what it said also , " Just Friends " .
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Offline Carl

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Re: Relationships: Making Friends
« Reply #24 on: November 09, 2014, 05:50:30 PM »
Thanks guys. I will definitely mention it in the relationships guide when I work on Romance. I do want most of the levels that can appear there, and that one is interesting.